[Nlnog] meer discussie!

Tue Jun 22 11:08:31 UTC 2004

Hi Sabri,

Ik denk dat het een prima uitgangspunt is om vanuit te gaan.  

Het is waarschijnlijk handig om mensen hun nic-hdl mee te laten sturen bij de
bio alsmede de nic-hdl van hun 2 'bekende'. 

nic-hdl:      bais-ripe

nic-hdl:      SAB666-RIPE
nic-hdl:      BOFH-RIPE  ( !!! )

Betekend dit, dat je een niet nader te noemen roodharige collega nu op #nlnog
gaan weren ? ( tijdens het in-between jobs zijn ? ) 
En wat te doen met toeleveranciers ? Of partijen welke zelf geen ISP zijn ?
Er zijn bep. 'insiders' wat in deze een uitzondering op 95% regel zijn .. En
hoe gaan we daar mee om ?

Met vriendelijke groeten,

Erik Bais

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: nlnog-bounces at nlnog.net 
> [mailto:nlnog-bounces at nlnog.net] On Behalf Of Sabri Berisha
> Sent: dinsdag 22 juni 2004 11:45
> To: nlnog at nlnog.net
> Subject: [Nlnog] meer discussie!
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Naar aanleiding van wat discussie in het IRC kanaal, bijgaand de
> volgende 'voorwaarden' die ik vond over een soortgelijke mailinglijst
> als nlnog. Mijn voorstel is om iets soortgelijks van toepassing te
> verklaren op deze lijst. Met name het stukje over 
> vertrouwelijkheid (als
> ik op deze lijst zeg dat AS12859 netwerkpanne had wil ik dat 
> niet morgen
> op Webwereld teruglezen) staat mij wel aan. Uiteraard zou eea ook van
> toepassing zijn op het irc kanaal.
> 
> Meningen?
> 
> 
> "Cyber defenders, ever vigilant, ever responsive." -Marjorie 
> Gilbert, 2003 
> 
> Step one is to insure you meet the qualifications for NLNOG. 
> Some common 
> questions to ask yourself are: 
> 
> Do you work for some type of IP transit provider, huge multi-homed 
> content provider, or service provider? 
> Does your job include Operational Services? 
> Are you willing to offer free services, data, forensic, and other 
> monitoring data to the NOG community? 
> Do you have authorization to actively mitigate incidents in 
> your network? 
> Do you actually log into a router and do something to 
> mitigate an attack 
> or call someone to task them to do the work? 
> Do you have the time for a real-time NSP mitigation forum? 
> 
> If yes, then you might fit the expectations to be on the NLNOG 
> Mitigation or Discussion Forums. 
> 
> NLNOG PARTICIPATION EXPECTATIONS 
> 
> NLNOG is a forum to get work done in the service of the community. As 
> such, realistic expectations are placed on the NLNOG 
> membership. These 
> expectations are periodically reviewed by the NLNOG 
> moderators to ensure 
> that an individuals community membership is relevant, 
> productive, and adds 
> value to the mission of NLNOG. These expectations, which have evolved 
> through active membership feedback include: 
> 
> All posts to NLNOG must have an organizational affiliation 
> via either a 
> corporate email address that is identifable as an ISP/NSP, or via a 
> signature that includes your organizational affiliation or ASN. 
> Lurking and learning does not contribute to the community  there are 
> other forums for that. Silence often indicates that people are not 
> handling the information provided by the NLNOG community or that the 
> information provided is of little relevence to the member. 
> Acknowledgements of action  whether publicly on the mailing list or 
> privately to the people involved  provides members of the 
> community an 
> indication that contributions are being made. Recognizing specific 
> national laws, regulations, and/or corporate policies may 
> prevent some 
> members from posting on the public NLNOG alias; these 
> limitations do not 
> prevent private mitigation correspondence. 
> Taking information provided on the NLNOG forums and using it for 
> commercial gain is not allowed. It is a violation of trust to the 
> community. 
> 
> NLNOG is built on trust. Therefore, reposting NLNOG communications to 
> individuals inside or outside your organization is a 
> violation of that 
> trust. NLNOG members should have the span of control to take 
> action on 
> the information from an NLNOG correspondence without widely 
> posting the 
> information inside their organization. If forwarding inside the 
> organization is required, permission of the posters must be sought. 
> NLNOG postings must not be CCed or BCCed to any other forum. Internal 
> dialog must be re-crafted for internal use as mentioned in previous 
> guildelines. 
> 
> 
> 
> NLNOG APPLICATION EXPECTATIONS 
> 
> Membership in NLNOG is restricted to those actively involved in the 
> mitigation of NSP security incidents within organizations in the IP 
> transit, content, and service provider community. Therefore, 
> it will be 
> limited to operators, vendors, researchers. That means no press and 
> (hopefully) none of the "bad guys." It also means that 
> engineers who do 
> not directly work in the core transit/content provider 
> network do not fit 
> the purview of NLNOG and should look for other forums
> 
> NLNOG is not a community for lurkers who wish to "learn more 
> about NSP 
> security." Individuals who are part of the NSP attack 
> mitigation community 
> at times create whitepapers, presentations, and training materials to 
> educate the larger community. Much of this material will be 
> presented to 
> NANOG (http://www.nanog.org) and other NSP operations forums (RIPE, 
> APRICOT, and AFNOG, etc.). A set of links below offers help for those 
> looking to learn more about the tools, techniques, and 
> training used by 
> the NLNOG community. 
> 
> NLNOG will use a simple trust/peering relationship. This 
> model is not as 
> "secure" as an encrypted conversation, yet it is better than 
> a wide-open 
> public dialog. All applications must be accompanied by at least two 
> existing members who will vouch for the new applicant. We 
> will establish 
> the trust by asking members of the list to vouch for new subscriber 
> requests. If the list administrators know the person, then 
> they can vouch 
> for them. 
> 
> No information presented in this list is allowed to be 
> forwarded or shared 
> outside the NLNOG community without specific permission from 
> the poster. 
> It is expected that members strictly adhere to this policy to 
> ensure list 
> confidentiality. 
> 
> 
> NLNOG APPLICATION FOR MEMBERSHIP INSTRUCTIONS 
> 
> Step one is to insure you meet the qualifications for NLNOG. 
> Some common 
> questions to ask yourself are: 
> 
> Do you work for some type of IP transit provider, content 
> provider, or 
> service provider? 
> Does your job include Operational Security? 
> Are you willing to offer free services, data, forensic, and other 
> monitoring data to the NSP community? 
> Do you have authorization to actively mitigate incidents in 
> your network? 
> Do you actually log into a router and do something to 
> mitigate an attack 
> or call someone to task them to do the work? 
> Do you have the time for a real-time NSP mitigation forum? 
> 
> 
> If you'd like to be considered for membership, please provide the 
> following information via email to: bofh at nlnog.net
> 
> Name: 
> E-mail: 
> DayPhone: 
> 24hrPhone: 
> iNOC Phone: 
> Company/Employer: 
> ASNs Responsible for: 
> JobDesc: 
> Internet security references (names & emails): 
> PGP Key Location: 
> 
> For Job Description  be as detailed and descriptive as 
> possible. After 
> sending the above form via email go to the section below and issue a 
> "subscription" request via the form. 
> 
> NEW MEMBERS 
> 
> When a new member requests membership and provides his/her "bio" (as 
> above), once the moderators decide that the potential member 
> has passed 
> their initial review, that person's bio will be sent to the 
> full list. All 
> applications must be accompanied by at least two existing 
> members who will 
> "vouch" for the new applicant (preferably not from the same 
> organization). 
> Any existing member will have 48 hours to send reservations 
> about that 
> potential member to the moderators. The moderators promise to 
> review in 
> depth any facts that are raised in regards to any potential 
> new member. 
> 
> RESERVATIONS AND REBUTTAL 
> 
> Any reservation about an existing or new member that is sent 
> privately to 
> the -owner list will have all identifying aspects stripped out of the 
> email and forwarded to the potential rejectee for rebuttal. 
> That person 
> will have 72 hours to send a rebuttal before a decision is taken. The 
> moderators of the NLNOG list will attempt to take all matters into 
> consideration before rendering a decision. 
> 
> REMOVAL 
> 
> A majority of the moderators will be required to remove an 
> existing member 
> or to override a new potential members candidacy for the list. 
> 
> NLNOG REVETTING 
> 
> The NLNOG Moderators will periodically review the membership 
> and select 
> some members for revetting. This is required to ensure that 
> all members of 
> the list continue to fit the charter characteristics. Both 
> employment and 
> the charter can change over time - this mechanism allows the list to 
> remain true to its charter. 
> 
> The revetting process occurs in three steps: 
> 
> 1. The member selected for revetting will be asked to update their 
> information, and submit it to the NLNOG Administrators. 
> 
> 2. Should the member continue to meet the required 
> characteristics for 
> NLNOG membership, the members information will be sent to the 
> list for 
> revetting. 
> 
> 3. At least two members of the list must re-approve 
> membership. At least 
> one of the approvers must be from a different company than 
> the member who 
> is being revetted. In addition, other members selected for revetting 
> during the same cycle may not approve each other. 
> 
> Note that not meeting the requirements of each step will 
> result in removal 
> from the NSPSec mailing list. Those so removed may reapply 
> through the 
> normal method, although the two-company approval requirements will 
> continue to apply. 
> 
> 
> 
> NLNOG PHYSICAL MEETINGS 
> 
> The IETF experience demonstrates that the most effective way 
> to build a 
> community on the Internet is through a combination of virtual 
> meetings 
> (e-mail forum) and physical meetings. NLNOG follows the same formula, 
> having small meetings and BOFs at the various operations and 
> engineering 
> meetings around the world. Following is a list of the active NLNOG 
> meetings and the contacts for the chaperons/facilitators for these 
> meetings. 
> 
> Please let the community know if you are interested in coordinating, 
> chaperoning, or facilitating meetings at other forums. 
> Volunteerism in 
> service to the community is welcomed. 
> 
> -- 
> Sabri Berisha - SAB666-RIPE
> BIT BV  - http://www.bit.nl/
> AS12859 and AS31064 - lg: http://noc.bit.nl/traceroute
> _______________________________________________
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> 
> 